The Making of a Mortgage Pro with Jared Methia

I’m Vernon.I run the top mortgage brokerage in Massachusetts with over 20 years of experience.I’m Craig.I’ve done $100 million consistently since my second full year in the business and I’m Massachusetts’ top mortgage broker.We’re the Mortgage Daddies with real advice, real stories, and real results.Let’s get going.Welcome back to Mortgage Daddies.Today we have a special guest, Jared Methia.Jared is a loan officer with us at Milestone.He’s been with us for couple of years as a loan officer and a few years before that.Yeah.About, uh, 4 years now.Been a loan officer for about two and a half.Started helping out in the beginning stages when Craig brought me on, assisting with the marketing piece, then, you know, the licensing might have took a while to get, but we got it, and then, uh, after that, the rest is history.Yeah.Jared’s pretty, uh, fan favorite here in the office.Always positive no matter how bad anything is going, and, you know, he can dish it out.He takes it.He’s a good team player.I’d say over the last couple years you’ve really grown into yourself.I mean, I’ll be honest with you.I didn’t have super high expectations when you first started off.I love that.I that.I love to hear it.That’sYou what I mean?Um, but I knew you had the drive in you, you had all the right tools.Craig definitely saw something in you, and, uh, I definitely see it now.You just, uh, made first President’s Club that we’ve ever had at Milestone.Yeah.Congratulations.Yeah, man.That’s a huge accomplishment.That was, that was stressful.There was times where I was like, “I don’t think it’s gonna happen.”We know the numbers that we need to hit.And I was like, uh, I’d come in some days and be like, “Nah.It’s not gonna happen.”Then couple months go by, you start picking up some steam.Then it’s like, “All right.I think this is gonna happen.”And I remember I’d always come in, like, to Craig’s office and be like, “Dude.I, I think I got it.”But it’s like, you don’t wanna, you know, count your eggs before they hatch as far as you getYou could have 5 deals in, but are those 5 deals gonna close?And if I needed 4 of them, you know, 2 don’t close, now we’re having a different conversation and I’m sad not going on a, you know, awesome trip that you guys put on for us.Was that something that you felt really, like, helped push you the last quarter of the year?Uh, yeah.100%.I mean, as far as the President’s Club becoming a thing, and then as fa- as far as the leaderboard being put in place, ’cause it’s like we’re all former athletes w- we compete.It’s what we do.That’s why I love this business so much is where once you guys put the leaderboard into place, like, I’m seeing these names of people I work with every day, or it’s like, say I know I’m working more hours and putting in more time and they’re still getting above me.It was like, “What do I have to do to beat them?”Because at the end, we had like a, kind of like a group at the end that was like a herd of people that were on the fence of getting there.And it’s like, “I’m not gonna be that guy that doesn’t get there ’cause that would just piss me off, you know, forever.”Yeah.I think that the competition side of it is a huge piece of this business, you know, for loan officers.And, you know, so many times at the end of the year everybody’s worked hard.It’s been a long, you know, year.The, the last quarter is- Yeah.Holidays are coming, holiday parties.It’s super easy to kind of start to check out.And I think that was something that this year really helped kind of push everybody at the end of the year to really s- you know, keep their foot on the gas.Yeah.Just keeping motivated.And I think, you know, for Jared, I see it, I hear it from business partners in the real estate community is that, you know, he’s out there, he’s a team player, he’s showing up to events, he’s supporting the cause, right?Like, he’s out there helping.He’s a lot like you in regards to educating the, the home buyer going through that process.That’s kudos to you, man.Like, you’ve only been doing this for 3 years.And to be one of the top guys here at Milestone, and really, the sky is the limit for you.What, what kind of motivated you, or how’d you get into the mortgage business in the first place?I know you’re friends with Craig, but it takes a special person to say, “I wanna get into the mortgage business,” because this is not an easy game.And some people might see it from the outside and be like, “I’ve known Craig since high school,” or, “I knew him in high school-” Yeah.”or I knew him when he was at the fire department.”It’s a whole different animal, right- Yeah.when you get into it.Can you talk about, like, where you thought the expectation and what you were gonna be able to do?And then we’ve all gone through the down part, right?Yeah.Like, talk about some of that ’cause you’ve, you’ve been able to ride through some of the downturns and things going sideways and not really-sure.always going your way.No.I mean, you gotta ride the highs ’cause the lows are low in this business.And it’s just inevitable that’s what’s gonna happen.It’s like a rollercoaster at times until you build enough, you know, referral partners that trust you where it’s like you’re never gonna hit a low, similar to like what you guys have done being able to maintain, just continue to grow year after year.And, getting into it, I have a lot of friends in different industries where it’s like I know if they came to mine, it’d, it’d be tough.Yeah.And if I went to theirs, it’d be tough ’cause it’s definitely not for everyone.But getting into the business originally, Craig and I, we’re are both members at the Country Club in New Bedford.We were golfing there one day, and finally, I was just like, “You have to go to college for what you do,” because school was never really my thing.Like, I played sports.That was fun.The, the only reason I would have went to college is to play a sport- Sport.of some sort just to, you knowThat would be my main reason to go.I didn’t really know what I wanted to do.And when he said, “You didn’t need to go to college for this,” I was like very intrigued where I’m like, “Okay, cool.Just tell me what I need to do.”Yeah.And, you know, whatever.If that took 6 months or a year and a half-doesn’t matter neither here nor there ’cause, uh, once you pass the test, you don’t really have to look- Yeah.look at it ever again.But getting into it and starting to go to the office.Even before I was licensed, I would see Craig in the office from 8:00 to freaking 8:00 at night, 9:00 at night at times.And I’m like, “Oh, man.”And I remember I’d be there and I was helping out with marketing, so I was on like a salary, whatever.And I would just want to be around it, even if I didn’t have to.You know, 5:00 came.I wasn’t like, “Oh, cool.I’m gonna leave, go get some dinner with my friends.”Like, I wanted to stay around it because the more you’re around it, the more you learn.And obviously in this business, you know, the more you learn, the more you earn as far as is somebody gonna go work with a loan officer who has like 0 knowledge, works 9:00 to 5:00, then leaves?Or is it gonna be someone who’s gonna let you know they’re available all the time like what we do here and the business model you guys have kind of taught me?Where it’s like, all right.If it’s 10:30 at night-You don’t necessarily have to respond, that can wait ’til the morning.But if you want to, you can.Yeah.Where someone else, say a banker, is not gonna respondSo, you guys putting, um, kind of the game plan in front of me, and like, I’ve been able to learn so much from the both of you as far as you both have unique styles in the business.So me, from a, you know, outside standpoint just watching throughout the course of the beginning, pulling some little tidbits of what Vern does and some things that you do and being able to ki- kind of blend them together, I think has helped my business, you know, a substantial amount.Yeah, I mean, I think that, you know, one of the things, like, that you guys kind of both touched on is, like, people see it from an outside, right?You know, you see me at the golf course.Yeah.You see me out and about and it’s like, “Oh, wow, you know, he does well, it’s fun.”Like, youbut you don’t see the grind- Grind.that we put in on a daily basis- Yeah.or how much it’s likeIt’s one of those professions where it just, it never stops.Yeah.Oh, oh, “Craig and Vern, they dress nice, they drive nice cars.I wanna do what they do.”Until you get into it, then you don’t.’Cause like that time you- Yeah.you’re running out of a burning building when we’re running into it.Yeah.And it’s like, i- it’s crazy, where- And we drive nice cars, like, for 4 minutes a day because we’re s- locked in the office for 14 hours.Exactly.So it doesn’t make sense sometimes.Um, talk about like, I mean you’ve taken on a little bit of a, like a leadership role as a team leader, I know under Craig and he’s grooming you, uh, to do that.How does that f- make you feel that, you know, somebody like a Craig Snell, afterYou know, he’s a veteran- Mm-hmm.in this business.He’s now, uh, an OG per se.How does that make you feel to, to help others in the industry, either get into the industry?E- explain to them the ups and downs andSometimes, you know, I pulled you into my office and I’m like, “Jared, you can’t let the down bother you this much.”Yeah.”Just try toIt’s, it’s all the same.”Yeah.”Don’t ride the highs too, too high.”I know you said that earlier, but- Yeah.”because when the lows come, it can be a dark place- Yeah.if you let ’em s- l- keep you there.”Yeah.And I would say about a year ago I had a lower moment in my career, ’cause I w- came out of the gates pretty hot.I was, I was, you know, getting a good amount of loans coming in, closing a good amount of deals, making some money.And then a, you know, a low came.And I was like, I didn’t know how to personally take it, where it was like a lot of me talking with you or sitting down with you, like behind closed doors.’Cause I’m like, “IWhat do I have to do?Like, what am I doing wrong?”essentially.And that’s where I learned where it’s just like, you gotta keep going.You could have a f- pipeline of 5 to 10 deals, but if you’re not working to get the next deal, orLike, you’re never gonna continue to grow and become stable, I guess you could say.Yeah, I think that’s like a problem that a lot of people have when they start.It’s like, you know, they, they work, they learn what they need to do to try to get some business and then they get the business and then they like, fix on it.Yeah.they just like, kinda like stop doing those money-making activities because they have some stuff in it and they’re watching it or they’re getting too nervous about what’s going on.They’re trying to get too involved in the process.And you know, one of the things I love about you that you do that is very similar to myself is, you were, and he’s not lying, like he would sit there and just hang out and listen to us, you know, on the phones and talk and, you know, was in the office all day long, after hours, always having questions, always wanting to figure out how to get better.You know, which was what I did- Mm-hmm.I started with you.So I saw that in him and I was like, you know, he’s gonna put that effort in and like, you can’t teach that effort.No.Like you can teach somebody loans, you can teach somebody how to talk about interest rates, you can teach somebody.But, you can’t teach somebody hard work and the will, the, the, the want to learn.And then when you also like, even now at this point, like, you’re not afraid to ask questions, you know?Yeah.Too many people are afraid to ask questions.Mm-hmm.”Oh, I don’t wanna look dumb.I don’t wanna sound dumb.I don’t wanna go ask Craig or Vern a question.”You’re not afraid to do that because at the end of the day, you care more about your clients and making sure you’re getting them the right answers- Mm-hmm.in the right situation, or the realtor the right thing whereYou know, so many people get themselves in such bad situations- Yeah.because they’re, they’re too afraid or they think like, “Oh, well now I’ve been doing this too long now, I can’t ask a question.”Or- I- I ask questions to people all the time.Yeah.Or, or when s- you have to.Someone reiterates something to a client that’s just completely wrong.Now that, that’s in their, the client’s mind and they’re not gonna forget what you said if it was an important thing and whereI have no shame inIf I’m on the phone with a client and they ask me something, I don’t know the answer, I’m gonna get that, I’m gonna get right back to you on that.Mm-hmm.feel like too many people will just be like, “If I don’t give an answer, I’m gonna look stupid.”No, you’re gonna look stupid if you give an answer that’s incorrect and then it, you know, jeopardizes the deal.I think with you it’s just like consistency though.There’s just, the consistent work ethic, right?Like, you’re doing open houses on the weekends.But at the same time, it amazes me that you’re able to go golfing, uh, you know, with your girlfriend.You’re able to go on vacation.Like, you’re still grinding at a high level when you are here, right?Mm-hmm.And that disconnect, like kudos to you.It took me 15 years to learn like there’s gotta be that work/life balance, right?Yeah.It took Craig a- a while after he started ’cause you jump in and you’re just like inundated.That’s all you wanna do is just loans, loans, build up that business.And then you, you, you look back and you’re like, “HolyI haven’t had a life for like three years, four years.”you were able to pick that up.I mean, you’re a young guy.I mean, how old are you?26.26 years old.I mean, I got i- into the business at 25, 26 years old.Mm-hmm.Like, you’re already ahead of that piece of it.And you already figured it out, right?Yeah.Like, I- I go through coaching and I’m like, “Guys, you need to separate your calendar.Like, where is your you time?Where is your spouse time or your time with your kids?”You’ve been able to pick that up in two or three years.That’s not normal for this industry, so.Yeah.I- I think a big part is having the, like the rightLike, you, two of my mentors right here, where you help out more on the, you know, business development side.And say, like, uh, personal life side, where it’s like you harp on the most you have to enjoy life as well, but you gotta put the work in if you wanna enjoy life.And you’re, you help out with my business development as well.ButAnd then, on the loan side of things, where it’s like I go to you with the questions, where aAnd I got, like, emailed him yesterday, all caps, HELP.’Cause it was like one of those things where a weird file came through, somebody wants to put an offer in, and I’m like, “I’m not gonna be the guy that ruins this.”So it’s like- it makes you feel any better, Jared, I sent him the same email sent I knew that.So I figured that was okay toI was waiting for you to be like, “Oh, yeah.Vern helps me with loans.”You’re like, “No, I’m not calling to him asking him some technical-” “question on something I know just changed three months ago.”Yeah, ’cause I it takesI mean, granted, I have the, you know, the luxury of being three offices down from, from you guys.Yeah.So, but it takes that extra five minutes just to feel that much more confident in a file.And then, you can call that list agent and feel that much more confident in a file.’Cause I’ve- I’ve had some go in where, you know, I’m- I’m 90% sure it’s gonna work.Get that anxiety the time.AndYeah, w- when I call that list agent-I’m like, “Yeah, the file’s good.We’re- we’re- we’re gonna be solid.We’re gonna close 90%, 95%.”But then, for the next 27 days, I’m every morning-waking up.I could have seven more files or deals I’m working but I’m focusing on that one, making sure everything goes smooth.Jared has the highest level of anxiety of any loan officer at Milestone.It’s outstanding.he- he worries- it’s amazing.about everything, which for me shows that you care, right?Yeah.Like, you care more about the consumer and the loan closing than anything else, right?Like, and taking that extra step of walking into Craig’s office to review the file.There’s too many loan officers in our industry that I feel like they care, but they’re too embarrassed or they don’t want to say, “I’m gonna walk into my mentor or my boss or, you know, Craig’s office and take three minutes to answer two questions.”inevitably could cause jeopardy to your business relationship, the culture- Yeah.your brand, right?Like, we’re all in the mortgage business.And you’ve been aYou’ve done a great job with this, is, yes, we all work at Milestone.We’re allMilestone’s like where we hang our licenses.But you’ve done a great job of building your brands as Jared Messia as a loan officer.No oneI mean, people might know that Craig Snell works at Milestone, but they’re working with Craig Snell.They’re working with Vernon Miles.They’re working with Jared, Jared Messia.I get calls weekly about you, “Hey, Jared just showed up to the office.He just popped in here.He’s- he’s doing these open houses.”That’s Jared doing the work, right?That’s not the company.And, uh, I think we’re lucky to have you, and like the sky’s the future, man, if you just keep grinding it out.He keeps talking about being an athlete though, so we have to have fun on Mortgage Guys.Can we please talk about this piece of it?’Cause coming from a couple athletes in here, we’ve had some jokes around this.Let’s talk about a little bit of the athleticism that this s- At-young man has at 26 years old for our viewership.Has-been.I’m a has-been.He- he’s aYou’re a Hall of Famer.Already.Yeah.High school Hall of Famer.youngest Hall of Famer ever for- for Vogt.I don’t know.It’s gotta be close.I’m gonna have to get that sta- Yeah, no, it was, uh, we won a Division II baseball state championship back in, uh, 2017, and, uh, it was a fun time.And since then, I’ve went on to break my ankle in a company kickball game.That was awesome.So I think- I, I think, I think my, uh- Those days are over.Yeah, I think my sports stick to Monday night, you know, men’s pickup basketball, where no one jumps for rebounds.No one, no one really boxes out.No one’s gonna get hurt.Unless you’re playing within the game.IYeah, yeah, exactly.I was just being selfish here because, when you first started off, I think probably within your first year, somehow, my wife ends up being friends with you on Facebook or something, and she’s going through like the- the- the picture or something, and there was a- Shout-out Sue.There’s a- Shout-out to Sue right here.There’s a picture of Jared, like his junior or senior year, high school football.He’s got the whole black eye going.He’s got- he’s got a goatee when he’s like 17 years old, like- I think he had a goatee when he was in eighth grade.I think he had a goatee when you wereWhen did that thing start?Oh, man.Stuff started happening to my body pretty early in life.I think maybe s- seventh grade stuff, you know, hair startedwife looks at me and she’s like, “This is like a grown man.kind of hot looking guy in high school, a little Friday Night Lights action.”I’m like, “We gotta take care of this guy.”We got- we got the- the- the- the audience over here just shaking her head, Friday Night Lights Jared.He’s, uhFast-forward six, seven years later, I’m at a networking event with Vern.”Hey, guess how old this guy is, huh?””I don’t know, 35, 36.”I’m like, “Oh, this is awesome,” so everyoneBut I don’t hate it because-In our, in ourPeople may think I’m older, which is not a bad thing because at the end of the day, what we’re doing is such a big, you know, crucial point in someone’s life where we’re dealing with- Yeah.hundreds of thousands of dollars being exchanged.And, you know, sometimes it could be almost like a stereotype on like, I don’t want this 25, 26-year-old kid going throughWhen I first started, 24, seeing my bank statements, going through my income- Mm-hmm.handling my loan.I wanna go with someone who’s, you know, 35, been in the business for forever.Which, you know, isn’t necessarily fair to the younger LOs, especially when you’re getting into the business because like, I think now is the time.Like, we, we have so many people joining Milestone now.You guys do an awesome job with recruiting and, you know, building the company.And a lot of them are older and they’ve all been doing it for 20, you know, 20 years.But then you get the newcomers where I feel like some people might not wanna go this route in the industry, just due to the fact where it’s like, “Well, no one’s gonna take me serious because I’m younger.”Yeah.But it’s, I think it’s all about how you present yourself.Yeah.I think, you know, I felt that a little bit when I started, too, and like, you know, for you guys- Yeah.you know, you obviously you guys got into it younger than I did.But I think it all just has to do with, like, how you talk to people- Mm-hmm.and the confidence that you have.Like, when you have the confidence, there’s not gonna be a doubt on the other side.Yeah.When you areLike, y- I’ve seen younger people and theyThe way they talk and it’s like, they, they feel- Fidgety.skittish on top, you know?Yeah.And I remember when I first, first, first started and it’s like, okay, certain clients I was fine with.Yeah.And then there was, like, those other clients that are like, it was the older guys, financial guy or whatever, A educated, they know what they’re talking about.you know, well off.And I’m like, I’m nervous talking to them because I don’t want them to ask me something that I don’t know.But it’s just over time that goes away- Yeah.because, you know, you get more comfortable, you know that you know those answers now and, you know, that, that does go away.But you just, you can’t be afraid of it.You just gotta be confident andI would s- I would say that’s something that you and I do well with in bringing on new people, like the Jareds and the Jacobs and a lot of other people in the, in, in our business.But he has to be one of the most matured 26-year-olds I’ve ever been around, right?I mean, from everything he does, for the most part.We’re not gonna get into, like, your extracurricular activities- Get out ofPresident’s Club.Shout-out to Avery Stinson.I just wanna shout-out to Sue on this one now.No, she takes care of me.Yeah, I mean.But in all seriousness, you’re probably one of the more mature, you know, um, 26-year-olds out there.I mean, y- you have a long work history.Yeah.I think that came from my dad- Yeah.where before the mortgage business, before I came over, I worked for my dad for three years on some television shows.And I was very close with him as far as, like, on a business side of things, where how he would run the company and how he would kind of present himself.I would, I would go to all the meetings, similar to, like, what I used to do in the beginning with you.Every training you had, I’d wanna go to it because maybe I’m not, not at the point yet to have a training in front of 20 realtors, but when the time comes, I wanna know how to do it.Yeah.Be ready.And it’s just taking it all in, knowing how to present yourself, because at the end of the day, how you present yourself is how, you know, people are gonna trust you.I think that being, you know, being around people that are doing things at a higher level is very important to the growth of your own business.Yeah.Yeah.You know, where it’s like if I didn’t listen to you talk when I first started, I wouldn’t be at the position that I was at so quickly because you don’t pick up those things.You don’t understand how to talk.You came toWe, we had a meeting the other day- Yeah.that I went with you guys for and it’s like, you texted me after and you’re like, “You know, that was awesome,” because, you know, I picked up a few tidbits- Yeah.of stuff.The way you talked, how you said certain things, you know, how you go about it, how you keep the conversation going.It’s important to kind of understand that.Yeah.And, you know, I think the people who don’t have as hot of starts is because they lack that.Like, they’re just focused on trying to get business themselves.But you gotta understand that you have to put time in that maybe you’re not gonna make money off of.That’s very important.Like, going to other meetings, sitting in on meetings, staying after, watching another person that’s above you.You know, it doesn’t necessarily have to be the top guy, but just somebody else.Like, everybody goes about business a little different and when you can take little tidbits from- Exactly.different people and you kind of put that together and you figure out your own flow and your own vibe, it’s like now you have that confidence level.Yeah.And, and then the sky’s the limit.And this isn’t a recruiting pitch to everyone watching, but-if you’re notIf you’re at somewhere, a place where, like you were saying, maybe you’re not around people who are doing, you know, far higher volume than you, you’re never gonna learn.So like, if somebody’s in the industry and they’re at another company where their top guy’s doing four or five loans a month, why are you still there?Mm-hmm.Versus being here and being able to Who’s gonna show you how to do 10?Yeah.Who’sExactly.Or 20?WhoAnd-and learn how, for example, I’ve been to 25 first-time homebuyer seminars with Craig.I can go do one.If somebody called me tomorrow, I can go do it.Absolutely.know how to do it.The meeting we had last week was with, uh, 2 broker owners of a real estate company.And I’ve never been with Craig on a meeting like that.I know he does them all the time, but I’ve never been involved in a meeting of that, uh, nature.And it was very, you know, eye-opening to see, okay’Cause you watch their reactions when they’re going back and forth.I can see what, you know, what they’re kind of, what’s hitting them, what they like to hear.There’s not really anything bad they like to hear, just due to the fact that what we do and the caliber of people we have, where it was just inspiring to see, okay, now I feel confident where I could go meet with a broker owner, kind of have the similar pitch, put my own twist on it.’Cause like you said, everyone goes about things in a different way.And, uh, yeah, I think that it’s very crucial being at the right place and the right company, having people above you showing you kind of the ropes, as well as, you know, learning from them.Yeah, me- mentorship, I mean, we talk about this a ton on this show, but like mentorship or having a good mentor and somebody that you actuallyBut it’s not just, like, sitting there and, like, having them train you.It’s like shadowing them is super important.Mm-hmm.Like in all aspects of business, like the people that I have seen that have done the best here have done that.The people that I’ve seen that have done it in real estate and as realtorsYou know, they worked under people, they worked under teams, they were under a good structure, they learned the basics.Like so many times people get in and they’re like, “Well I wanna make, I don’t, I don’t wanna make less money on my deal, so I’m not gonna go on a team,” or, “I’m not gonna go under somebody.”And it’s not necessarily you to go on a team- Yeah.to make less money, but like, you know, there are even more on the real estate side, or even on this side to a point.But it’s like, if you’re just starting off, y- that, it c- it’s like g- it’s like paying for college.Yeah.Yeah.Right?You’re paying for an education out of your commission to a point.Yeah.Yeah.Like, if you’re a realtor or you’re a loan officer and you’re starting out, or maybe you’ve been in the business for a little bit of time and you’re, you know, you’re not really, like, taking off, maybe i- i- it’s time to relook at how you go about things and go shift and maybe go under somebody else that can help you.Because one, when you’re around somebody that’s successful, success follows.Yeah.100%.And, and opportunity follows, right?Yes.Like, there’s so many relationships that I have gotten just by hanging out with you, and there’s so many relationships that you’ve gotten by hanging out with me.Same page.Like, you wouldn’t have gotten to those situations.Yeah.I wouldn’t have gotten to those situations without being there with you.so many people miss that.Yeah.Like they get so tunnel vision and focused on, like- Dollars.”No, I just wanna make this.I’m not giving part of my commission to the team leader.I’m not giving part of my commission to this.I wanna make all the money.”And they try to go off on their own, like way too fast, and it just, their, their business just ends up flopping.ItAnd the mentorship should never end.No.Right?Like that’s the kick I get out of it.And we’ve seen loan officers, you’ve been definitely around long enough where they think they’ve hit, they’re ready to, ready to fly.They’re gonna go open their own brokerage, they’re gonna go do this.And you’re like, just s- more seasoned, older guys- Yeah.just look back and I’ll walk into Craig’s office to him like, “Good luck to her, good luck to him.”It, it never- Like, I already know because they’re 2, 3 years out, just from a mentor.Like, I wish him the best.Yeah.But the chance that you’re gonna be able to go without having the certain contacts or going through, like, just business.Like, I learn a lot from the guests we’ve had on this show, right?There’s a lot of self-employed entrepreneurs, Dean Snell, LaPoint, there’s been, uh, title companies.I learn a lot from those guys, right?If you just sit and listen, like God gave us 2 ears and one mouth for a re- a reason sometimes.And it’s, uh, it’s wild to think like that.Like your dad, to be honest with you, like the handful of times that I’ve never sat down for hours with him, I’ve learned more in talking to, to John for 10 minutes- Yeah.that doesn’t even realize that he’s almost, like coaching, mentoring, because it’s just little things that you can tweak out and listen to somebody.Uh, when Dean was on the show, I learned 4 or 5 different things and I’m like, “Wow, that’s a good idea.”That, you know, you can implement that in all fields and all different types of businesses.’Cause at the end of the day, you’re running a business, you’re in business, individual loan officer- Yeah.no matter what, just pick up little nuggets from some of the old school guys and it’s gonna pay dividends down the road.No, and I 100% agree.And everyone knows I like to talk, but I do listen a lot.Yeah.And if you’re not listening in, like if you’re always the loudest in the room, but you’re nev- never letting someone else speak and kind of explain maybe their roadmap of how they became successful, you know, you’re just gonna be in your own head for the rest of your life trying to figure it out.And to touch back on the mentorship where it’s cool where I can have my bosses and my friends be my mentor.You know what I mean?Yeah.’Cause it’s, it’s guys I see every day and I look forward to coming into work seeing you guys and learning from you.And when you said, you know, people get to a point where they think they don’t need a mentor, I think is insane, especially in this business we’re in.’Cause, uh, you get s- someone like Craig who he’s doing 35, 40 loans a month, then he gets to 80.Say, I catch up one, hopefully I catch up in, in years down the road and I’m doing 30 loans a month, but if I say, “Okay, I’m doing 30 now, I don’t need you anymore, Craig,” how am I gonna get to the 60?How am I gonna get the 70 loans a month?Like it’s, it’s never ending, theHow do you start building a team?How do you start, like branching out?Therepeople don’t understand is like it’s, it’s hard to grow and it’s hard to, like, figure out.’Cause then you hit a point, like one, it’s hard to get the business.Then once you get the business, well now you have to maintain the business and you have to be able to handle the business.Well, how can you do that?Now you have to put people in place.You have to build teams, you have to, you know, put the whole situation together.Well, there’s a lot of trial and error th- when it goes to that stuff.So it’s like- And get more business.You can skip a lot of those failures if you have somebody that’s like, “Hey, I’ve done this before.This is the best way to do this.”Or, “Hey, you really are at a point now where you’re hitting a wall because you don’t have this.You need that.”Right?Like you did that.You were like, “Hey, you need somebody now, you can’t do this anymore by yourself.”Yeah.”You need to go have somebody help you with X, Y, and Z.”And then it’s like boom, next level.Yeah.And then- Right.you do it again, next level.How I coach or mentor is like I want that person to feel the pain before you give them the way out, right?Like-I’ll tell, I’ll tell my son, “Don’t touch the stove.”But I’m only gonna say it once.Yeah.I want him to actually in the back of my head, touch the stove, get burnt.And then I can say, “Look, I told you that.”Because you’re gonna start building trust over time with that loan officer, my son, that says, “Oh, this old man actually knows what he’s talking about.”Yeah.Then it’s like, all right, let’s start giving him some nuggets.Let’s start throwing it out there.And it’s crazy to see that even ifI mean, you’re a mentor to a lot of people.The things that I learned from the people that they call me the mentor, I’m sitting in a coaching class 2 days ago with some people and I’m like, “I just learned something totally different, a whole nother angle to go out and build everybody’s business.”So if you’re always learning- Yeah.I think that’s the key, man.I’ve, I’ve seen, I’ve heard you 1,000 times help other people where it’s even friends of yours, where they wanna open their own shop.Yeah.you never talk down to them.You help them.You show them what it takes to open their own, you know, brokerage.And I think that’s awesome versus trying to pitch someone.You’re just gonna be there to help them out- Yeah.which is great where just back again to the just the support you get in you’re mentoring people that don’t even work at our company.It’s crazy like, we were talking about this the other day when we were driving into Boston.Like, these people that you’ve helped out or these people that ask questions or these groups that you’re in, eventually it kind of all comes full circle.Yeah.And it’s like, now some of those people are joining Milestone because of, you know, what we’ve been able to do.And it’s like- Yeah, they team, then they’re coming back home.Hey, you know, this doesn’t really likeIt, it’s a lot of work.Like it’s not f- Just like being a loan officer is not for everybody, running a brokerage is not for everybody.It’s a lot of work that goes into it.And- Mentoring leadership comes down to just having the balls to want to step into the batter’s box in the bottom of the 9th with 2 on, 2 out and a full count, right?Like, me and Craig were in the car driving to Boston to just bring that right back up and kind of set this, the stage for it.And, uh, we jump on a call.It turns out to be a, a pretty crazy call.It’s, it’s got a lot of potential.But without Craig and myself being able to put ourselves in that situation, put ourselves out there, there’s too many broker owners of real estate companies and mortgage companies that just wanna keep everything internal.It’s like they, they have a secret sauce.I’m like, “Here’s the sauce.I’ll give it to everybody.Like, if you wanna go use it, I’ll help you.”Yeah.”I’ll tell you what I did.I’ll tell you what companies I used.Use them, don’t use them.”But I want to listen to, “Hey, that worked for you?Yeah, let’s see if that works kind of in our system.”Um, but you never stop learning, right?Like, that’s why I don’t mind helping everybody because these calls and because of these groups, you can’t scale a business to where Craig and I wanna take it to a whole nother level without partnerships and relationships.Yeah.So is it worth just holding it down withIt could, Milestone could have just been me and Craig, 3 or 4 support officers.Just poppingMaybe one or 2 loans, and we would have, we would have been fine.And to, to touch- But how much fun would that have been?Yeah, right.You guys wouldn’t have me.Yeah, come on.Suck, suck.I think we would have.Yeah, probably.To touch on it, though, where I’ve told you a million times, like, I’m a lifer.I don’t, I never in my future do I think like, “I’m gonna go, you know, try to open my own shop.”Yeah.Because it’d just be, you know, what am I doing at that point?I’m gonna go open my own shop to what?Make a maybe full boat?Yeah.But then go against the, you know, the biggest company in, in this?It’s, it’s, it’s not only that, but I would want you to go open up your own shop, right?No way.like, seriously.On record, I’m never leaving.For the record, like, I want you to get out there because if that’s like a burning desire that somebody has inside- Yeah.is to go do that.But I always want to leave the door open.And Craig’s heard me on this, and I’ve seen him do it now with business partners.”It’s okay.You wanna go work with this other mortgage company?”Yeah.I wanna leave the door open, right?Because I’ve left the door open to all these different mortgage broker owners that I’ve helped, help build their business or coached them up.Now, we’re getting to the scale we are and now they’re calling and saying, “You can’t scale past X without the expenses going completely out of control.Can I just come and run a, a team over at Milestone, bring my entire group over?”They know they’re gonna make more money.Yeah.They don’t have the headache of the overhead, right?So, I hope that you go andNot I hope you go, but like- Nice.I hope as many people go out, but leave the door open, right?Like, we’re friends.Yeah.We can go grab a beer, go grab dinner.The real estate agents, this is the same thing.It, it’s too many times I see people do everything and listen, I’m old.I’ve been doing this for a long time.I look back at my own career and I’m like, “I coulda handled these 3 or 4 situations, 2 or 3 of them like blaring in my head on a regular basis.”I’m like, “Never do that again.”Like, I coulda gone about that a different way, but at the end of the day you just gotta recognize that.me being like close with you guys, I’m able to tell you where I know it’s happened to both of you hundreds of times, where you start getting recruited by places and then it becomesYou know, people think it becomes weird.I didn’t think it was weird at all ’cause I would just come to you guys and be like, “How do I respond to this nicely and and you know, let them know I’m very happy where I am.You know, thanks for the offer, but I’m, you know, I’m not leaving.”And you guys help me out, craft up an email and send it back to them in a polite way, ’cause like you said, you never wanna burn r- you know, uh, relationships- They might be, be working with us still.Exactly.So it’s like- Or we might be working with them.And bringing up the recruiting thing is, I remember giving Craig, and I had no coaching on this, it was completely off the whim.He might have thought that I was really smart at the time.I just, I played this one off and I just hoped for the best, is, Craig, 3 years ago, 2, 3 years ago, he’s getting recruited by top players- Yeah.nationwide, right?He’s getting recruited by the top retail lenders in the nation, and they are throwing money around.I don’t even owe this much money on my house, right?Like, it’s wild.7 figures across the board.And he, he comes to me, tells me, he says, “Can I just get”You know, “What do you think I should do?Should I go on this follow-up recruiting?”And I’m like, “Friend, you have to go on these recruiting things.You have to do the right thing for your family, but more importantly, you need to get recruited so when the time comes, you know how to recruit and know how to act to go and recruit the next person.”Because, you know, there’s probably not ever gonna be another Craig Snell, ’cause we all run our businesses differently, like we talked about earlier.But if he never gets recruited and never goes on a dinner and never goes through that entire process, how’s he gonna recruit somebody down the road, right?Yeah.Like I’m not only looking at every single person who lo- uh, that’s currently at Milestone.I don’t have them in a box that this is their only job that they’re gonna do for the next 25 or 30 years.Like, my job is gonna evolve almost on a daily basis.Like, Craig and I talk, I’m like, “I don’t even know what I do here anymore.”Like, every day it’s a different task, it’s, and it’s ever-changing.But when it comes to that recruiting piece, I wanna have as many recruitersEverybody at Milestone should be a recruiter- Mm-hmm.of, uh, in some capacity.I wanna help people grow to where they want to achieve what they wanna do, right?Like, processors wanna run a team of processors, loan officers wanna be a branch manager or run a team, or whatever it may be.That’s kind of what Craig and I have kind of morphed our roles into, is like really helping as many people grow as possible.watching you over the short period of time you’ve done it, dude, it’s wild to see the, the growth that you’ve had over the last couple years.Yeah, I mean, it’s, uh, itHonestly, like not to sound like cliche, it’s just a lot of fun.Like, coming into work and being able to work with you guys- And our s- this guy’s laughing.Like, what’s on over here?He says it all, no, he says it all the time.It’s just fun.You know, like- I agree.I could have the worst day, but it’s like still, okay, something’s going terribly wrong with the deal.Oh, not our fault.Someone else’s fault.Yeah.You know?But, um, it’s just, like you leave your, walk out of the office, you see everyone, and it’s like you could just ha- be having the worst day ever, you see someone, you have a little conversation for 30 seconds, and now your kind of mood shifts, whereYeah.I mean, I think like as a whole, like the culture that we have here- Yeah.is so different than anywhere else, where it’s not just the help in the business, because like we, we really don’t lose people, and people get recruited all the time.Yeah.And you know, when I was getting recruited, it’s like what, the way they’re going about it or the things they’re talking about, it’s like, yeah, the money’s nice.Like- Yeah, everything sounds cool.I the 7figure sign-on bonus, which would’ve been great, but at the end of the day, like you start to think about it and you start to look at the overall picture, and you’re like, “Doing that is gonna affect my business.”Mm-hmm.”And I don’t want that to affect my business.”Like, I wanna be at a place that is gonna put me in the best position every day to win and to be number one.I don’t wanna go anywhere else just for some money.Yeah.Like, that’s not what I’m here for.Mm-hmm.And it’s like, we’re around the same type of people that have that same mindset- Mm-hmm.where it’s not just about the sign-on bonus.Like, there’s so many loan officers out there that just jump around from company to company to get some money, get this money, and you just see their numbers going down and down and down.We’re bringing people in and their numbers are going up and up and up.Because you’re in the right situation, you’re at the right type of a company, the right kind of a structure, with the right type of people and the culture.And then, you know, that’s what we’re building here.I’m not, we’re not gonna throw around money and sign-on bonuses.We’re never gonna do that.We’re gonna go and we’re gonna give you the best option for you to win every day, become the best loan officer, because I’ll tell you right now, you’ll make a lot more money double the amount of deals than any sign-on bonus that you’re gonna get.And for you guys, it must be cool to, you know, run a company where you don’t need to throw money at people and they wanna come here.Yeah, it’s pretty- Yeah.Like, that’s gotta be an awesome- It’s pretty cool.EspeciallyThat’s gotta be a pretty awesome feeling for- Yeah.a company that’s five and a half years old, where big names are coming over, and- Yeah.you know, you’re not on a, a money-throwing hunt.I think the business has shifted- laughed-a lot, you know, before that.Yeah.The only reason I laughed when you said, “It’s just really fun to come here and, uh, and to work,” like, we’re all coming here to work.We’re all doing the same things that other people are doing.We’reIt’s a job.My daughter came in yes- yesterday, and I’m supposed to sit there for like an hour or 2 with her, and jammed out all day, non-stop, right?Saw her for like probably 5 minutes.But I have so much fun when I come here.I look forward to coming to work.Like, I can’t wait to get to the office and start working, start seeing the people, interacting.I think that’s really what separates us.I don’t thinkI mean, I pull in here sometimes when there’s, like, operation staff that have already been here for an hour.And I’m like- Yeah, it’s insane.8:15.”Like, “What are you guys doing?”I think a lot of places like, uh, real estate companies, mortgage companies, whatever it is, is like, they don’t have that same type of, like, camaraderie where, you know, you’re just as willing to spend time helping somebody with their deal as you are with your own deal- Mm-hmm.where other companies, it’s like, “Well, I’m not gonna talk to them.I don’t want them to know how I’m doing.”Yeah.why am I gonna help that person?They’re ahead of me.”Yeah.bring them to my event.I don’t want them to talk to my agents.I don’t want them”And it’s like, we don’t have that ’cause that started from the top down.Mm-hmm.So it’s like, allow for that to happen here.You’re not gonna come in here and be, like, that type of person.You’re gonna bring somebody with you because they’re gonna be able to learn something.Mm-hmm.And if they get an agent, you didn’t have that agent.No.You know, it’s kind of like theOr if they get a deal, you didn’t have that deal.You know, and we don’t have that kind of, uh, issue, you know, here where IYou know, I was talking to a- a guy that I know that- that runs a real estate team, and it’s like, you know, he just feels like it, the company, like they just go after eachIt’s like cutthroat, yeah, man.It’s like- You they’re cutthroat to each other.”Why do that internally?”Yeah.You know what I mean?Where- You know what I hate to say, it does start from the top.Like, Craig and I, right from the- the jump, like, he was in the business, like, 6 months.I’m like, “Hey, here are all these agents that I just don’t have time to get to, but I don’t wanna lose their business.”So I’m not sleeping at night because I’m just working nonstop.So it’s a relief, but coming from the top down from all of us, it’s like, “Why would I go after your business or somebody in the office?We’re gonna weed you out.”Like, “If you’re that guy-” Yeah.”that comes in here and you’re just going after everybody’s, uh, we’re gonna push you outta here.”Yeah.Like, “We don’t even want you here.”Where, like, what you touched on where, when Craig came on, you know, 6 months down the line, and you were like, “I’m getting too busy,” where it does happen, where it’s like you wanna be able to give all your referral partners your 100% effort.Yeah.Where it’s like I’ve had times before where I’ve been fortunate enough for Craig to say, “Hey, like, couple of these agents, like, I want you to kind of work with them.”Like, where el- what other company are you gonna go e- uh, to where that could be, you know, potentially an option for you?Yeah.Obviously, you have to put in the work.It’s not like I just walked in, and I was like, “Hey, Craig, I need 5 agents.If you don’t give it to me, I’m leaving.”It And the cool thing is, is as we continue to grow as a company, we’re building more relationships.Our brand is getting out there.Mm-hmm.Real estate agents in the community wanna work with Milestone, but there’s only one Craig Snell, right?Yeah.So y- so he- now he can say, “Hey, I run a team of 40 loan officers, and I got 4 that I can dedicate to your office.I’m gonna oversee it on a- on a higher level.”That’s an awesome feeling to know that you have 4 people, that he has 4 people that he can trust to stick in that office, trust with the relationship, and run with it, and-turn it into something awesome.The cool thing to watch from the outside toowell, from the inside, is I’ve had agents tell me they don’t feel comfortable accepting an offer unless it’s a Milestone approval, whether it’s Bern, Craig, you know, myself, Eric or Rob, Rosemary.You know what I mean?Yeah.They don’t feel confident in accepting that offer unless weyou know, Milestone’s name is on it, which I think is awesome- Yeah.which I’ve talked to you about the other day, where like, the weight our preapproval holds, it’s like, yeah, do we call the list agent to, you know, tell them we vetted the borrower and, like, we’re good to go, we’re not gonna have any issues?Yeah, anyone could do that though, but it doesn’t mean what they’re saying is 100% true.No, absolutely.I mean, that’s something that’s been super important to m- myself since I’ve started.And it’s like when we started, it’s like nobody knew Milestone.Yeah, it wild.got preapproved from Milestone.They’re like, “Who the hell is Milestone?”They’re like, “Is- is that Bern?”Like, ’cause like he’d been around, and I hadn’t.Yeah.I’m like, “Yeah, yeah.”And they’re like, like, “Just give us a chance.You just gotta build it.”Yeah.”You gotta build it.”And it’s like- first 6 months, I don’t even tell anybody, “I work at Milestone.”I was just like, “Yeah, it’s my preapproval.”They’re like, “What’s Milestone?”Like, “Eh.”Yeah.It takes a while, but it’s like that reputation at the end of the day, and that’s something that’s just gonna keep going.And like, you know, that’s like our focus now, is like we’re gonna go and get more relationships to be able to feed the people that we have- Mm-hmm.continue to do that and do that and just keep replicating that because itthat works.Yeah.And then when you put the people in place to- to handle that business and to spend the time, it’s like you can’tyou can’tone person can’t do everything.Yeah.It’s impossible.And- and it’s any business too, where it’s like if you have someone putting in a lot of effort and time, you know, those are typically the people that are gonna be like, “Okay.”Like, for instance, my brother owns landscaping company.He’s got 5, 6 guys where if one of them is doing a little bit more, he’s like, “All right.This is your crew now.You run this crew.”Yeah.”You’re gonna get a little bit of a pay bump, but you’re gonna be responsible for these people underneath you.And if something goes wrong, it’s on you.”And I think that’s likeI mean, just about everything we’ve kind of talked about and just to kind of wrap this up, like, the people who put the work in the hardest and always are there and they’re gonna put that extra effort in, you’re gonna get put into opportunities that youthat, that person behind you isn’t going to.Like, if you’re there, you’re willing to go to things, you’re willing to help out, you’re willing to put that extra effort in, people see that.Like, your bosses see that, you know, yourThe people that are above you see that.And then who do you think they’re gonna call when they need something, they need help with something?Or, like, you know that person that was mentoring you, are they gonna call some other loan officer that- Yeah.they’re competing with?No, they’re gonna give you the business because you were there putting that extra work in.And that’s across the board.But my man, it was a pleasure having you on the, uh- No, I appreciate-on the podcast.Appreciate having me.Jared is killing it, baby.Keep it rolling.hoping to get the call-in a little sooner, but, you know-Episode 67 isn’t too bad, right?We had to keep your an- we anxiety level high, you know?Yeah, no, I appreciate that, for sure.Itnow he knows we can’t fire him or anything like that.It’s like, he, he made it through the pod, so he at least gets 1 he at least his episode to air.Yeah, exactly.Don’t put this on the shelf, Javier.This is airing.All right, guys.See you next time.