Sales is Sales: The Yacht Broker, George Fearons

Mr. Craig Snell sitting shotgun with me 24/7. Wherever I go, he’s always my right hand. He’s always, we’re, we’re there for each other. He’s like, “Let’s take this out!Let’s open her up!”I’m like, “I just got like a 15-minute tutorial on how to ride a, to drive a boat and operate the boat. I’m not really feeling all that warm and fuzzy. “I used to go on boats all the time with grandfather. I know these seas. Sure enough, what’s Craig Snell do?Anybody who knows Craig well, he only has, uh, two speeds, park and turbo. Uh. And, uh, we- Uh!we got out of the, out of the, the bay and he hit turbo all the way to New Bedford in about, I don’t know, six minutes from where I keep a boat in Marion where- That’s what makes George havewhy sell them lemons. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, so uh- Yeah. heading back from New Bedford in turbo, top gear. He’s like, “Let’s see how fast this will get up to. “We hit a whale. I’m Vern. I run the top mortgage brokerage in Massachusetts with over 20 years of experience. I’m Craig. I’ve done $100 million consistently since my second full year in the business, and I’m Massachusetts’ top mortgage broker. We’re the Mortgage Daddies with real advice, real stories, and real results. Let’s get going. All right. Welcome back to Mortgage Daddies. We got George Fearons today with us. We used to, uh, used to be in the mortgage business. Yep. Now you’re still in sales, but doing things a little different now. Yep. Not selling necessities anymore. You’re selling hobbies. That’s right. Yeah, it’s a little different, but it, it’s all the same stuff. Yeah. the end of the day, sales is sales, right?And- Yeah. take care of the customers and, like you guys do. So, that’s my, uh, that’s my world. Yeah, big George, been friends with him for the last five or six years. And, uh, you know, one of the first things he says to me, he’s like, “Oh, you like boats?”Like, “Yeah, I like going on boats. “Takes me on his boat. Fast-forward, I don’t know, a year into the relationship. Takes me down and sells me a boat. Still have the boat. I wish I could use it more. But- Yeah, we, everybody wishes they could use it more. I think it’s a great, great thing. I mean, you can sell Vern a boat, you can sell anybody a boat. That’sDoesn’t know how to use a boat. Doesn’t know how to dock boats. Wanted a cheap boat- Yeah. ends up without a cheap boat, you know?Yeah, yeah. We go back to the first day. You sure you don’t wanna get back into mortgages?We go, we go back to the first day of your boat experience. Not me. Not me driving the boat. Hey, I gotta get back to the office. I’m good. Thanks, George, for giving us a little tutorial on how to use the boat, where everything is. Mr. Craig Snell sitting shotgun with me 24/7. Wherever I go, he’s always my right hand. He’s always, we’re, we’re there for each other. He’s like, “Let’s take this out!Let’s open her up!”I’m like, “I just got like a 15-minute tutorial on how to ride a, to drive a boat and operate the boat. I’m not really feeling all that warm and fuzzy. “I used to go on boats all the time with grandfather. I know these seas. Sure enough, what’s Craig Snell do?Anybody who knows Craig well, he only has, uh, two speeds, park and turbo. And, uh, we- Uh!we got out of the, out of the, the bay and he hit turbo all the way to New Bedford in about, I don’t know, six minutes from where I keep a boat in Marion where- That’s what makes George have anansell them lemons. Yeah. Yeah, so uh- Yeah. heading back from New Bedford in turbo, top gear. Hmm. He’s like, “Let’s see how fast this will get up to. “We hit a whale. Or an object that hasn’t moved for the last thousand years. That’sYeah. Allegedly. Allegedly. Yeah. They must have changed. Yeah. No. Vern calls me and says, “Some-” Global warming. “the boat’s broken, George. “”You sold me a bad boat. “I go, “Vern,” I, I go, “What happened?”He goes, “Well, we took off. I let Craig drive. “I go, “I’ll be right back. “I went down to the boat. I looked at the GPS tracks. Cut it a little close to the ledge. Yeah, a little, little close to the rocks. It would n- But- Honestly, global warming. Those weren’t there before. Yeah. Yeah. Right, right. But he got the first, uh, the first repair bill right out of the way. Yeah. You know?I that was a cool like- Like, took the sting, took the sting-five,out of ownership in the first eight hours. Yeah. You know what?It, I suggest everybody does that now that I’m looking back on it. Right. Because if you hit something and you blow out the lower end of the engine and it costs you, I don’t remember, $6,000, $7,000, like when you go to have to refuel it, it costs you, I don’t know, $500 or $1,000. No, everything’s cheap after that. You’re like, “Whatever. BigIt’s not a low rent. You’re welcome. Right. since. George, the ultimate salesman that he is to one of his close friends, asked me what my budget on a boat is. Well, if you would have been not so cheap, you could have got one with a, you know, autopilot, and we wouldn’t have had those problems. Yeah, I know. We need to do s- Or a captain. Yeah, that probably would have been the better- I thought I had Captain Snell on board at the time, but I didn’t ask to see his insurance or his, his captain’s license. That was my mistake, but- Good. Yeah, it was reading fine. I am, honestly, I- Yeah. I didn’t know was asure it was the boat’s problem. Yeah. If it had autopilot, we’dnever operated a damn windmills. Yeah. Blame it on the windmills. Right. Everybody else does. Yeah. Yeah. Those sadly weren’t there back then, but. Yeah. so George, tell us a little bit. I know you were in the mortgage business. Yeah. So, I, I, IA big part of my career, um, it’s funny. You know, when we became friends, we, you know, you didn’t know that. And I started telling you, and you’re like, “Oh my God, this guy was in the same business. “You know?Yeah. So I worked for Plymouth Savings Bank for a couple years, uh, during refinance crazy. Um, my territory was Brockton, so I learned the hard way, um, doing two families and investment properties. And then, um, I made friends with, uh, my local PMI rep, and, you know, she said, “Hey, we’re looking for a, we’re looking for a new salesperson doing second mortgage, um, high-LTV home equity loan insurance for banks and credit unions. “So, from that point, I left the, I left the bank, and I went and worked for United Guaranty, which was a division of AIG. And I spent like, you know, six or seven years on the road selling high-LTV home equity loans. And, uh, business was really good. Until it wasn’t. But, um, you know, I learned a lot about sales and a lot about, um, the insurance business and the, and the MI business, which you guys know about, and the 80/10/10s and the 80/20s and 100% LTV. And, um, it was an interesting time and a profitable, fun time for the family. I was gone a lot, 180 nights a year was my, was my average on the road. Um, but it was good and I learned a lot about the business and, uh, then, you know, things started changing in 2007, ‘8, ‘9 when the world ended. And- Let’s, let’s talk about that, right?Yeah. ‘Cause I was around in those ’07, ’08, ’09 days and world ended, everybody’s running out of the burning building. And I remember we were, we were probably friends for six to 12 months. I never knew he were in the mortgage business, right?So he starts talking to me about LTVs and DTIs and I’m like, people that are in our business. Like that’s not- Right. normal lingo. So then when we’d start talking, he’s likeAnd I learned a saying from him, I’ll never forget. He’s like, “Oh, those were some of the best days of my life. “back up to Brink’s truck every Friday afternoon-to drop off my check. Right. Uh, because back then it was just people were making crazy money but you had to, you had to work for it. And, uh, you know, I was like, “How did you know?”Right?’Cause I was still new when he was pretty much almost probably- Yeah. exiting out of that business. Right. I was like, “How did you know that that was gonna crash and that was gonna happen, like, coming up?”And I’m gonna let you tell the story- Yes. because it was amazing. So our, our home office was in Greensboro, North Carolina, which is the mortgage insurance capital of the world. The second mortgage capital of the world. Mortgage insurance capital of the world. And, uh, there’s like four, four or five MI companies there. And we had a big office, right downtown Greensboro, and I think my, where my team was was on, like, the third floor and the claims office was up on the top floor. And we, I never went to the, I never went up to claims because we never really had any issues. The th- times were good, um, you know, LTVs were hanging in there, uh, excuse me, values were hanging in there, people had jobs, no problems. And each of my customers had a claim here and there and I’d go up there, you know, once every, once every couple of months when I go to Greensboro. Yeah. then as I started to go upstairs to see them more, I’d walk down the hallways and, and yet, and all the, the, um, the claims, um, officers, you know, they’re, the guys who were in these, uh, doing the claims, you know, on their desk was a small pile of manila folders and then the piles started getting bigger. And then in 2008-I walked up there one day and they were piled up in the hallways. Oh, myclaims were, you know, you couldn’t get in people’s offices and, and they’re just sitting in there feverishly, like, writing claims and, and paying out all these defaults on these high LTV home equity loans that we had insured against- Yeah. default. And then, unfortunately, they were all defaulting. So it just started, you know?It started with, uh, the loss of jobs, the, the real estate values that were highly inflated. Yeah. And then, um, people, you know, people just started reallySome of my customers, I’d go to them and pick up paper and keys. And I, they’d say, “You know, Mr. Jones has defaulted on his loan and he came in here and he gave us the, the keys to his house. “And then we became, um, you know, we, weIt was AIG and they were insuring the world, so that really took a, a painful turn for AIG at the time, too, because, you know, the whole insurance business revolves around reinsurance, right?So you might have home, home insurance or car insurance or boat insurance. Well, that’s reinsured by somebody three or four times- Yeah. on the backend, right?And, um, they were feeling the pain, and it was tough times. And we were talking about major players, you know, like Wells Fargo and Bank of America and, you know, I had all the regional accounts in New England, but some of the national, national accounts were, uhIt was, was pretty tough times. Hopefully we don’t go back to those times. Those were- Right. my best days and, uh, real estate, mortgage, just the US economy is kind of in a tough spot that they haven’t been in before. Yeah, and and I think that real estate, uh, you know, I’m not a, an economist, obviously, but I think, you know, the whole real estate, uh, market has changed so much and the values and, um, the appraisal business too, you know, that the whole appraisal world back then, and I can’t even get into all the things that were happening- Yeah. but as you know, it’s become a lot more, um, subjective and a lot more, you know, spin the wheel kind of thing, and you, and that appraiser that shows up is who you have to use. Yeah, I think technology also plays a big piece. I mean, now you have, you can go online and buy a Get a value. within $50,000, right?Depending- Right. upon if the kitchen’s been updated- Right. Yeah, you can’t call your buddy anymore and be like, “Hey, we need 500 on thisYeah, right, exactly. “Because”And- and- and- and we weren’t doing that but- but I knew that you- But were, yeah. you’d come through and you had $700, you know, a $700 credit, and you were, uh, you were employed for 12 months, and your house was worth X, you- you were approved, you know?Jammed. Yeah. And you could buy a house for 100% LTV, you know, you get an 80- 80/10/10 or an 80/20, people didn’t have any skin in the game whatsoever. Yeah. So they had no problem with saying, “Here’s the keys. See you later. “Mm-hmm. Because that’s what- that’s what was happening, and- Bought the house for $500,000, now it’s worth $350,000. I’ll hand you my keys. Right. Start over. Right, exactly. So no, it was, uh, interesting times, learned a lot, but you also learned about, you know, taking care of your customers at the same time, and you- you had to go into these credit unions and banks and sell them this process which was risky on everyone’s part, and they would, umIt tookIt was a long sales process, you know?You didn’t just walk in and say, “Hey, we’re gonna insure these home equity loans,” um, and it’s a lotSales is sales, right?I keep saying that, but it’s always the same in your business, my business now, the business I was in, gotta take care of the customer, you gotta be quick to turn things around, you gotta be detail-orientated, and you gotta treat people like they wanna be treated, right?At the end of the day, like, when I took you down to see your boat, like, it was, uh, it was just kinda like selling something to a friend, you know?Yeah. You don’t- don’t sell them hard, just show them, show them the product, show them what you have, show them all the benefits, like if you’re in the mortgage business, you show them the benefits of the house, the rate, the service you’re gonna give them. It’s the same thing in the boat business, you know?And then we take care of them after the fact too, because I get phone calls from people all the time on the boats that I sold boats to three years ago and they’re asking me about registration or they’re asking me about how to fix a latch and- and if you don’t answer them- Yeah. you don’t keep the relationship open. Mm-hmm. Yeah, that’s a big part of business for sure. We get that all the time on our side, questions about taxes, escrow, things like that, that, you know, once we close this re- we’re not really involved in that anymore, but you sit through, you walk in, people come into the office, show them, log in, help them, do it- Right. Right. because if not- You build a customer for life too, right?they refer you people because you help them and, you know, not everybody understands the whole process. Not everybody knows how to drive a boat. Right. Coming from the guy who’s the only person who’sdriving that day, yeah. Allegedly. Allegedly. For the record, my boat has had- I didn’t buy a boat. two incidences max, and neither of them have been me driving the boat. Well, we one. Full disclosure. I let somebody else borrow my boat. Ugh. And I think they ran something over and cracked the engine cover. Yeah. Right. So dealing with that right now, trying to get that all replaced. Did you get right into boats after 2008?Um, no. So I had a little, um, a little stint where, um, my wife and I started a small business, because we got laid off in March of 2008. It was one phone call to 27 salespeople across the country and said, “Sorry, we’re closing up. Uh, you know, we’re- we’re not writing insurance anymore. No more jobs for you sales guys. “So I had, I think, three or four and a half kids at the time. And, you know, we had a mortgage, we had everything going on, and, you know, Jill said to me, like, “What are we gonna do?What are we gonna do?”She was in there on the call with me ’cause I said, “Come in here and listen. “And- and she wasI knew it was coming, um, and she was obviously shocked, and she said, “What are we gonna do?You g- you just get another job in the mortgage business or the finance business. “That wasn’t the time to find job. I’m like, “Tha- that does- those jobs don’t exist,” you know?Yeah. So we got into, umMy friend, a mutual friend of ours, owned a snowshoe company, and I just went on the road selling snowshoes, outdoor gear. I went to all these, um, outdoor retailer shows, and I found, um, companies that needed salespeople, because in the outdoor business, they use manufacturers’ reps. They don’t use salespeople that they have full-time. They use groups of people that will sell their brand along with four or five other brands. Yeah. So I went to the bike show and I went to the, uh, clothing show and the outdoor product show with him, and I wandered around and said, “Hey, I’m a new sales guy. I’ve started a rep group,” and I had, like, five or six brands that- that Jill and I sold, and, you know, it was- it was good. It- it- it supported the family for a while, and then, um, you know, one of my buddies said to me, “W- what are you doing?What are you gonnaYou know, you’re gonn-” And he’d always been on me about getting in the boat business- Yeah. ’cause I was a boater and I was a sales guy, and I was like, “I don’t know,” and he’s like, “Now’s the time, man. Times are good. You should get into it,” and- and then- and ironically, he’s been doing it for 30 years, he’s a good friend of mine, I’ve been friends with him for 20 years. He sold me my first boat. Awesome. Um, and- and I ended up working for probably the largest outfit in New England right out of the gate with no, you know, boat or yacht sales experience- Yeah. other than being able to sell, right?And being a boater, right?And being around it for my entire life. So I was really lucky because who I work for is- is a really big outfit. We have all the top brands in New England, um, some of the- some of the best brands in the country. Um- You guys are the- one of the only distributors for Regulator around, right?Right. So- so in New England, we’re the- we’re the- we’re the Regulator dealer for New England. We sell Regulator, Viking, Princess, Valhalla, Everglades. Um, you know, we sell- we sell, umthe best brands in the sport fishing world and as well as the cruising world in New England. And, um, to get that job, I was r- I was really lucky, because the guys that have been there, they’d been there for 20 or 30 years, you know?And I was kinda one of the last new guys that they, that they brought on. And they, they wanted an office in Marion, or they wanted an office in the south coast, and I said, “Well, I live in Marion,” re- or Mattapoisett. And they’re like, “Well, if you can find a place, we’ll set you up down there. “And it’s beenthink we’re going on year seven, and it’s, it’s been great. I’m a one-man band there. Yeah. But, um, it’s been really good, and we’re lucky. And, and we’re the largest regulator dealer in the country. We sell the most regulators out of anyone in the country just in New England. That’s amazing. So it’s a, it’s a tried-and-true brand for New England. It’s a good, it’s a good brand. I’m glad you’re at Oyster Harbor Marines and your office is in Marion, because George being a full service friend and colleague and selling me my boat, was able to put me right into the marina. I didn’t have to go searching where I was gonna put the boat, if I was gonna trailer it. Took care of all that stuff, so. Um, you know, on that, like, you kept bringing up sales, and sales are the same. Right. don’t, I don’t believe we were selling anything, right?Right. I, I’m, I don’tI feel like I’ve never sold a mortgage in, in my life. IIf somebody wants to buy a house, they’re gonna buy a house, and my job is to deliver the money in a, you know, effective, timely manner. You didn’t sell me my boat. You showed me and, uh, educated me throughout that process and advised me, right?I mean, like- Right. they call us salespeople- Right. all the time, and we’re No one wants to be sold anything, right?No, I mean, like, you’re just so laid back. We’re advisors than anything. Yeah. Like, I mean, I, I look at you as, like, you knowNot from being friends, but, like, from buying a boat, like, my experience with this is as solid as it could possibly get, and that’s like what we try to deliver at Milestone. You just said, “Hey, here’s your options. This is where you wanna be. This is your price point. Oh, by the way, your price point, uh, you know, can double if you take out a loan. “Like, “Hey, it’s a small monthly payment. You don’t need to put all that cash down. “Right. Um- But I wanted to save your principal. Yeah, no, of course. You know?I wanted to, I let you do other things. But you, you showed me, uh, some different options, and you were really an advisor in that sense. And I think anybody, and I’m not trying to, you know, promote anybody, but anybody looking to buy a boat, you don’t wanna be sold, right?Like- Right. No matter what your budget is, $50,000 or $5 million, I mean, actually saying that out loud, what’s the most expensive boat you’ve ever sold?That’s funnyliterally about to ask himthe, probably t- uh, a Princess which was, like, 2. 8, 2. 9 mil. That’s awesome. Yeah. Those are rookie numbers. We gotta up that. Yeah. You gotta up the game, up the game. What Vernes do for new boats. Don’t, don’t, hey, worry, it’s just a payment, guys. Right, right. That better come with a captain- Right, right, right, right, exactly. because notNo, pick Yeah, as long as we’re paying. He’ll tell me, “Oh, don’t worry about it. Just wanna get a joystick for you. “Crash. Yeah. Right?For the s- it’ll be looking like a- We’ll get a captain for you. Um, no, it’s, it’s, it’s, right, and they’re toys, right?And it’s, and it, it actually is shocking to me, when I got in this business, how many people buy new boats, because every boat I’ve ever owned was a boat that I bought from someone else. Yeah. It was a used boat, right?And, um, it was just amazing to me that there’s a huge percentage of people, uh, that, that buy brand new boats from me every three to five years. Wow. And it’s just, and it’s, theyAnd, and there’s a lot of b-So we sell some great brands that don’t de- depreciate, but boats do depreciate, except when COVID was happening, there was appreciation in the market, but- Right, yeah. I bought mine before COVID. Oh. Right, right, yeah. Two months before COVID,Disclaimer, disclaimer. As he looks at a great time to buy a boat. I was like, “Wasn’t that right around then?”Um, but a lot ofUh, it’s just amazing to me that how many peopleAnd it’s great. I, I’m not discounting it, I’m just saying it’s just shocking to me that there’s a lot of people out there that want a brand new boat, shiny, you know, never been used, just by, just by them. And th- that’s a, a good perc- a, a huge percentage of our business. We do a ton of brokerage business as well, too, because we’re alwaysYou know, just like in the real estate business, you can come to me as a buyer’s broker, and I can go out and look for a boat for you, right?And I can represent you looking for anything you want. In nationwide or, or, or, you know, worldwide. Like, we b- we do deals all over the place. Wow. So if you said to me, “Hey, I want this boat, this price point, XXX,” we have an MLS system just like the real estate world, and we can co-broke with other brokers, you know, with, on their, on their boats. So there’s a lot to it, and we spend a lot of time doing that. We spend a lot of time doing the boat shows, going for the manufacturers. We have to go to Miami next week and each of us out of our team will be with each manufacturers at their booth to represent New England. So if someone comes in the booth from New England, that’s when we can talk to them. Um, but the, but the used boat business is a whole nother part of our job that we spend a lot of time searching for people. I have a list of people that are always searching for some certain type of boat that they want and if we find it, that’s when we can move forward. How often are you on the road now for these- A lot. boat shows and- lot. It’s a lot. going the- It’s, it’s, it’s probably not as much as the old AIG days- days. the mortgage insurance business days, but it’s a lot. And the funny thing is a lot of people say to me, “Oh, it’s wintertime. You must be slow. “Well, this is the time, if you’re not busy in the winter, you’re not delivering boats in the spring. Mm-hmm. So we spend our whole winters between the Lauderdale Boat Show, the Miami Boat Show, the Palm Beach Boat Show, the Stuart Boat Show, um, s- a little bit of the, um, there’s some stuff in Connecticut, there’s Newport, uh, there’s Boston. So we have to do all those shows and, and then we also have to, you know, try to, you know, be busy in the summertime, which is also another time that’s we’re doing deliveries. Yeah. And then we’re training people and we’re trying to help them get those boats going and they’re boats, so they have issues here and there. So we’reit’s a, it’s a full-time, 100%, you know, concierge, sales, customer service. It’s a lot, but it’s fun. It’s keeps you busy, keeps you out of trouble. I think Craig needs a boat. Yeah. No. Well, everyone needs a boat. Ev- I think everybody does. needs a boat. It’s just another payment. Right. Right?Right. And you guys do home equity loans, right?I mean, you can- cash out, pay cash for it. Yeah, of course. Exactly. Easier for George to negotiate- Right. it’s like buying a house. Right. Exactly. Trying to get a golf cart, not a boat. I like boats, but I just think I don’t- There’s a lot to it. There’s a lot to it. have two hobbies like that golf and- Right. and boating don’t really go hand in hand. Every day it’s good to go on the boat is a good day to play golf. Exactly. Right?And it’s tough. I mean, our time to use these things are only so- Very limited. limited, which is mind-blowing to me that so many people buy new boats are such expensive boats in this area- Right. when the season is so short. Right. Speaking of that, I mean, like you just brought up time and it just goes co- uh, you know, hand in hand. George might be the only man that ever comes on Mortgage Daddies that has more children than you do. So George, how many kids do you have?I think six. I think six. There might be an extra one floating around. He’s got an extra room that might be hiding in the basement he doesn’t know about. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Two, two older boys, um, 25 and 23, and then, uh, they’re off working. Um, and, uh, one in New York and one in Colorado. They, they graduated college and they’re, and they’re paying their own way, which is nice. And then, uh, four, four little ones at home still in grade school. Um, and actually one in one in high school, the other three in grade school. And,you got them ranging from like, what, eight- Yeah. nine to 25?Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Yeah. I used to say, uh, when, when my buddies would ask me, I said, “I have everything from condoms to diapers and everything in between. “You should never have to give- You shouldn’t try to watch. That’s right. That’s right. Always reusing the old boots, the old coats. Yeah. Yeah, Oh my God, ourYeah. We have like a, um, a, retail store downstairs for every size child if they, if they needOh,Every year they go to the closet and pick out their next year’s listYeah. Yeah. Exactly. And they’re like, “Oh, this stuff’s out of style. “I’m like, “Well, that’s too bad. You’re wearing it. “Because it was cool back when Patrick and Seamus were, uh, little, so it’s cool now. George, it’s awesome. We go up to, like, his house. He’s got a house in Vermont. We’ll go up four wheeling, snowmobiling, just the kids sledding. Like, “Shit, I forgot a coat. “He just opens up these, like, three big, like, bi-fold doors and there’s, there’s got to be 60 jackets in there. Drawers just filled with gloves and hats. Gloves and hats. The fun part is finding the matching one. Right. Right. Like that’s the game. Right. Right. Right. You just sit there and go through it, Yes. That’s wild, man, huh?Yeah, it’s a lot. It’s good. Mike: Jill- Because it’s- Jill works hard at it and it’s, uhUh, you know, but, uh, we always said, like, after two, you know, you’re outnumbered after two. So after two, it’s just a logistics game, right?Right. You got to keep them alive. You got to keep them fed. Um, and you just got to keep all these balls in the air, right?Yeah. And I think, you know, it is crazy and people look at from the outside at, you know, having six kids is, you know, like, “Oh my God, how do you do it?”And you just do it, right?Yeah. You just figure it out and you juggle it and you make it happen and, and they all, they all thrive off of each other. Like little Liam, who’s the baby, right?Um, he has been, he’s been, he’s been, he’s grown up in the pack, right?Yeah. And he’s, he’s got a vocabulary and, and a mindset and an attitude that he should have of the 13-year-old, but he’s, you know- That’s what his brothers and sisters taught him. Exactly. And he, and he can handle himself and he, he can, he can clean up after himself and he just, he’s a, he’s a great kid. And they’re all great kids, but it’s makes me want to have six kids, like seeing you and Jill. You guys done a great job raising the kids. Seamus works, works with us here at Milestone and Patrick’s super successful and the other ones are successful- Yeah. in their own way in high school and middle school. But damn, six kids and they’re all really good kids and-well respected and it just-Yeah, it’s a lot, but it’s- Well-behaved kids. I mean- Yeah. they’re still kids. They still have someYeah. They’re still kids and theyyou know, they have all their, you know, kids stuff, but at the end of the day, they’re all really good, and they’re happy, and they’re healthy and, and they’re figuring it out, and they’re doing a good job, soI mean, I haven’t heard all the stories about your older kids, like, growing up. I’m not looking forward to my kids being teenage, uh, you know, 18- Right. to 25. But after getting to know you and your family andI can’t wait to see little Liam- Right. at, like, that 16 to 22, I think. Yeah. That’s really gonna give George and Jill the real run ’cause- Right. he’s got a little, uhhe’s got a little savage in him. Yeah. Yeah. He’s got a little personality, edge. Right. He’s, uh- By that point, he’ll be pushing me around in a wheelchair, so-I won’t be really able to say much other than, “Go right, go left,” you know?SoBut, no. It’s, it’s all good. And, and it’s, uh, youSome days you feel really old and some days you feel really young, you know?think they keep you young Keeps you-you’re looking great. Yeah. Look at you. Thanks. You’re looking like a million bucks coming in here. Thanks. Thanks. I’m trying. You know, I think I have more gray hair than you do. I had to get it all shaved off yesterday, looking fresh. Well, the past episodes I’ve watched have beenreally, a lot of them have been focused on hair. I was interested to see those. You know, you had a couple- special haircut for that?Yeah. Well, I got my hair trimmed, but, I mean- There wasThe, the co- The couple episodes that I watched- Some back-to-backs. Yeah, back-to-back. Um, uh, y- the guy that works here, um- Yep. Steve. Steve. Yeah. Just Steve Carell or- Sorry. Steve Carell. Um, you know, he’s- Conan O’Brien look alike. Yeah. Yeah. Right. He’s gotHe’s got a, a really nice head of hair. And then, uhAnd then after that- Fabio. Yeah, exactly. Fabio’s got a whole routine. Right. Right. And then you hear their rou- explained the routine. It was pretty interesting on the podcast, soUh,Then you hear the routine about hairspray and blow dryers. Right. I’m a f- almost a 46-year-old man. I don’t remember ever spending more thanif I spend 60 seconds ever doing my hair- Right. It’sthat’s a long time in myIt’s gel, doo-doo, and I’m, I’m running out of my house. Yeah. So I, I went and, uhI bought a townhouse down in Florida and a couple of weeks ago was the first time I went down there. So I’m like, “I’m gonna just, like, order some stuff, send it down, so I don’t have to, like, carry, you know, a lot of stuff down there. “Yeah,And, uh, one of the things was a blow dryer. I was like, “I have to get a blow dryer. “You know, this just- Right. this just doesn’t happen. And, uh, so you get down there and, of course, the one thing that Am- like, just everything, like toothpaste, deodorant, body wash- Yeah. Right. All, all shows up to the house, open up all the boxes, I’m likeNo hair dryer?”Where the hell is this hair dryer?”Looking all around. Checked my Amazon order, not coming until Friday. That’s two days. Right. I can’t do that. Had to DoorDash another hair dryer. DoorDash!Now I got two down there. Now I got two down there. 2025. Right,Just in case one breaks, you always gotta have backup, you know?Right, right, right, right. It’s notNo, I’ve never had aI, I always just tell the barber, I go in and I say, “Just leave enough for me to comb over with my hand. “”And if I have a comb, that’s a bonus. “Yeah. I don’t evenI don’t even use a comb. Right, right. Yeah, you’re right. It’s short. Right. I didn’tI don’t e- really use a comb much either. It’s more fingers. Mine’s a l- very gnarly too. It’s very curly, so it’sI would love to see some long hair, you know?I might’ve just told Eli yesterday while I was getting my hair cut. I’ve seen Eli, I don’t even know, long time. And, uhI was like, “You know what?Next time I come in, I want you to mix it up. “Like, maybe, like, on a scale of one to 10, 10 being wild- Right. not trying to go there. Right now, I’m at, like, a two in my wild book. This is a two. Yeah. I’ll take it up to, like, a five. Right. So Eli, if you’re watching, I don’t want a mohawk. Correct. Like, I already know where he’s going down with this and- I think you should grow it out though, like a mullet would look really good on you. Yeah. Like longYou know, parting in the back-business in the front kind of deal. Whatever they say, I like that. Oh, God. That would be good. I should go a year without cutting the top. Yeah. Just trim the sides and see whathad a, I had a ‘fro in high school. Is that what that turns into?That turns into a very nappy ‘fro, soThatKids pay big money to get their hair curled like that right now. Oh, you think the- Because boyThe teenage boys are getting, um- Perms. perms. Yeah. I don’t want somebody to think that, like, a 50-year-old man’s getting a perm though, and it’s just all natural. think it would look great. You should definitely do it. Right. Ringlet curls. That would be great on you. Uh- I wish I had never said this on this episode. Yeah. I’m gonna throwbribe Eli not to ever cut the top now again. He’s not cutting the top, I don’t think, next time, so- I know. A whole trim. whole three-quarters of an inch. I get my hair cut every two weeks, so worst case scenario I’ll look like, uh- Right. I wish I had never brought up this hair thing, butIt comes up a lot. It’s amazing. Go on Mortgage Days and talk about your, your hair products- Right. and blow dryers. It’s nuts to me. Right. So tell me about what’s going on in the mortgage business these days. How’s the, how’s the rates?How’s the, how’s the, how’s the, uh, temperature?Yeah, I mean, the rates are amazing. I mean, we’re, we’re hanging out- Always a great time to buy. Right. Never a bad time to buy. I mean, obviously, refinance transactions are down right now- Yeah. just because of the market, but, you know, I, there’s still a handful of refis out there. I mean, people divorce, people pass, so there’s always family members- Life changes,taking it over. Like, the life changes those refinances are out there, um, but, you know, we’re just preparing for the, uh, the next wave. Right. You know, with the, market the way it is right now, it’s just gonna hit us like COVID did, right?Like- Right. you’re just gonna wake up. There’s not gonna be this, like, 12 monthI don’t believe so. Right. Not an economist, but- Right. I don’t think we’re gonna have a slow play into it. I think, you know, you’re gonna wake up, and in a matter of, like, two weeks, you know, the rates are gonna drop. We don’t need them to drop from where they are at 6. 5 now- Right. to 4. 00. Right. We need them to go from 6. 5 to 5. 875, and the refinances are gonna go bananas, right, because people can save a couple hundred, two, four, $500. 00 a month on their mortgage just by doing that. Or what I really think you’re gonna see is people downsizing homes, I feel like, over the last three years to two, two to three years, people are staying in their mortgages ’cause they have 3. 0%. Right. they have 3. 5%. Now if they can get that at 5. 75, they’re gonna downsize, or the growing family that, you know, had one kid four years ago when they bought a house now have two, they have three. They’ve grown out of their house, but their mortgage is very, you know, the, the rate’s at 3. 5% and they can’t really- Right. fathom going up, but I think once we hit those 5. 00s, I think you’re gonna see a lot more, um, property on the market, you know, from sellers. You’re gonna have a lot of buyers coming out of the woodwork. And more importantly, for us, refinances which are gonna free up, you know, the, the homeowner of having more cash flow in their house- Right. to spend on more goods and services out there, so I think it’s really gonna kinda help out the economy. I mean, I know- Yeah. real estate usually leads that way, and- Right. you know, we had the, uh, the Fed meeting yesterday- I think you’ll-didn’t change the rates, but- You’ll see a lot of people too pulling money out of their houses. Yeah. ‘Cause they’re sitting at 2. , 3. , 4%. Right. They don’t wanna go to 7. 0% to pull money out. Right, so put, let’s put a, let’s put an addition on. Let’s put the- Yeah, or pay off debt that they’ve- Right. accumulated over the- Right. last couple of years, so- Right. you know, if they can pull out, if they can refinance their house- Buy a boat. they’ll from buy a boat- I was just gonna say, yeah. buy a boat. Right. up $50,000. 00 as a down payment- Right. on that new $5 million- I mean, our-boat. our lenders that do the marine financing, they’re all 6. 00% 8. 00%. You know- Yeah. they’re, they’re, they’re, it’s not crazy, but- No. it’s obviously higher than it was, but still, people, I would say that probably 25% of my customers finance. Um, and- What’s the terms on boats?Uh, depends on the loan amount- Yeah. and depends on, there’s, there’s some underwriting that, you know- Based the year of the boat?Yeah, the year of the boat, um, uh, the p- the purchase price, uh, borrower, but they, you can go from, you know, 10 to 15 years on a boat. Yes. Um, so there’s, it’s, they can stretch them out pretty well. Yeah. ‘Cause in our business, the boats that we sell, you know, they’re, they’re not car-payment boats. These are mortgage-payment boats, right?Yeah, yeah, yeah. These are, these are big numbers. Uh, when you go to the boat show, like, like in Boston, we might sell six boats at that show when somebody else sells 16, but they’re selling a $399. 00 boat payment, you know- Yeah. like a little, uh, buzz-around boat or something, you know, something, like, for the lake or the, you know. But then when you get into a $600,000. 00 Valhalla or a Regulator, you know- Yeah, it’s a $3,000. 00 payment. 10 to 20% down, uh, you’re talking big numbers. Yeah. And then, you know, you amortize that over whatever the term is, it’s a big number, right?Why do you- For, for a boat. Why do you think that the boats don’t depreciate as much?Well, they, so the brands don’t depreciate. Yeah. Right?Um, there’s, there’s top brands out there, you know, uh, Regulator being one of them, um, Everglades, Viking, Valhalla, um, and, and we’re lucky to have those, right?Um, and then there’s, like, Grady-White and there’s Boston Whaler. Those are like the Campbell Soup of boats, right?Everybody knows. Some people say, “I have a Grady. “They don’t say, like, “I have a boat. “”I have a Grady. “The- they just use that. It’s like- Yeah. it’s like, say, giving, “Give me Kleenex. “Right?Yeah, yeah. “You know, don’t give me a tissue. Give me a Kleenex. “They use that brand. So there’s, there’s those top brands that don’t depreciate like others, but you have to pay for that right out of the gate. Yeah. It’s kinda like, same in real estate, right?You buy a, a, a bad house or a bad location, you know, the value- Location, location, location. location, right?Yeah. And it’s all about, in our business, it’s about the brands. And yes, they depreciate ’cause they are a depreciating asset- Yeah. but at the end of the day- not the rate of a car. Right, right. Yeah. And the other thing, too, is if we sell a Regulator, there’s always someI have a list of people that want Regulators. You know, I want- Just to buythis year, this month, and there’s, there’s always somebody to buy those boats. Not as much as there used to be because our business has, uh, slowed down as well, too. Yeah. But there’s still a list of people out there that want that brand. It’s like, it’s like a Mercedes versus, um, um- And they’re not making a million of them. Right, exactly. Like, can only make so many boats. Right. That’s the thing. That’s the thing. There’s a limited amount that they build, and when they, when they, when we order them, we order a lot of boats for inventory, so we have a lot in Osterville where we have, it’s sometimes $20 to $30 million with the inventory just sitting on the ground. So we buy- Wow. a lot of boats from our manufacturers, and we have a white one, a gray one, and a, you know, a, a, a blue one. And then we have, you know, different sizes and-usually we obviously try to sell the ones we have on the lot. But sometimes people order ’em. And they can order ’em and they, they build them for ’em and we deliver ’em and ship ’em and- How long does it take them to build a boat?Um, so it depends. I mean, obviously on the one. It depends because, um, we have build slots available. So when we, when you, when, when, when you’re gonna call me and say, “Hey, I wanna order a, a blue 28 regulator,” um, it should take three to six months depending on where that boat is and how many boats are ahead of it, ’cause they have a production line. They, those are built in North Carolina, a monster facility with lines of boats. But if we have a boat in line that hasn’t been painted yet or hasn’t, you know, we have a build slot- You change it to whatever thewe can change it, right?So sometimes I can say to you, “Hey, I’ll have that boat for you next month” or sometimesBut usually for a center console, we’re like three to six months. Bigger boats like a Viking, you know, those might be, we may be 12th in line for a 65 or, you know, a 72, so we have to wait for those to get through the production. So you could be two years. Mm-hmm. Right?Waiting because you came in after the other 12 guys ahead of you. Yeah. So, so every boat’s different to build. Um, the Princess yachts get, get built over in England, and they get shipped over to us on a ship. So that can be, you know, this, the one, the recent one that I sold had, uh, had already been in production, and he grabbed that slot, so he had it in under a year. But it could be two or three years waiting for that boat to be built and shipped. All right. I think you should really start looking at a Princess. Right?Like, there’s bedrooms. Like- Right. boats come in all shapes and sizes. If I did get a boat- Yeah. I would want one that you could, like, sleep on and- Right. andLike a yacht. Like a 72-foot, right,Yeah. Yeah, I mean, that’sAnything less than 75, what’s the point?Yeah. What is a, a- Yeah. 72-foot Princess- Uh, five, six-roughlyseven. You put it in now, you have two years to wait for production. By the time that one comes Right. And we can finance it, so now- Yeah. The kids will be out, the kids will be, uh, a little bit older. Perfect. You’ll be able to take it out around here, you know- Oh, yeah. three or four times a year. Hey- It’ll be nice for you. You don’t have anything else to do. Yeah. And a lot of times, uh, you know, our customers, they, they never come out of the water. They go from here to Florida, they spend the winter in Florida-they come back. So they’reIt’s a full-time thing. They use ’em to go down and spend the winter in Florida- That’d be awesome. Yeah,or the Bahamas or wherever lot better than an RV. Yeah. Right. That’s pretty cool. for, like, a retirement, like you’re in your- Yeah, yeah. late 50s, earlyI’ll my order in, 25, 30 years. and afterAnd it’s, it’s, like, after COVID, a lot of people also, like, started working from their boats, you know, working from home. ‘Cause we have, likeNow we have Starlink, we have this- Oh, yeah. internet that’s everywhere, so they have a S-We, we put Starlink in center consoles now, so they- Yeah, that’s pretty cool. can out offshore fishing on a 30, 40-foot boat and have everything. Put the backdrop behind it, pretend they’re on Zoom in the office, like all those TikToks- Yeah. where they’re the golf cart pretending they’re in theThey have emails and, and, uh, you know, you can watch the, you can watch the Celtics play on your, on your, um, screen, or you can, uh- I need to step up my boat game. I know, seriously. Hey, you don’t even have Starlink. Right. need to watch TV on my boat when I’m out there for the two hours at a time. The glare off the sun might be a little tough. Right, but, you know, imagine being able to preapprove loans from, you know, Stellwagen Bank. Yeah, yeah, that’d be awesome. to get a Princess or big Princess. No. You need to upgrade. No. We can find you a used one. Yeah. I need to find a- Something cheap. used captain to drive that thing-before I buy it. You guys crazy?Yeah. What’s, uhYou know, I was just thinking about y- you’re going through this and I’m like, you know, this guy really builds the relationships because a lot of the guy, the, the people that I’ve met through you and a lot of your friends, they’ve all bought boats from you. Yeah. It’s wild to me, like- So it’s like, it’s like in your business, right?The first thing you do when you’re in the mortgage business is you refinance your friends, your family members, and, mm, some of your enemies too, right?But at the end of the day, you wanna have that circle of people. Yeah. You wanna take care of them, right?Yeah. wanna do that ’cause if you can’t go and sell them all boats, that should be easy, right?Um, and then that, then that circle grows, right?And it’s just the same in your business and same in real estate and boat business. It, it’s just, hey, you tell somebody George took care of you like I tell somebody, “Hey, Vern took care of my mortgage for me. “Like, and then it justIt’s all about referrals, right?It’s all about just growing that spider web. And you wanna be the boat guy in Marion. And swear, you’re the boat guy. Like, every s- person I talk to, I don’t know if it’s just because I know a lot of the same people you do, I’m like, “Oh yeah, George, like the boat guy?”Like, everybody knows who George is. Like, before I met you, I didn’t even know there was such thing as the boat guy, right?The boat guy. Like, I didn’t even know where you would go other than to like- Right. should be the type-type in buy boat online, right?right, right. right. And you’re like on BoatUS. Right. Right. But other than that, that’s the title of the podcast, The Boat Guy. ButYeah, the boat guy. But it, but it’s- That’s a one,forget, like, in, in our, in your world, my world, you know, everyone has, uh, or they should, as you probably tell them, guys that work for you or new guys, everyone should have an accountant, everyone should have a mortgage banker, everyone should have a realtor, and everyone should have a boat broker. Right. If you’re a, if you’re interested in, in boats, right?Yeah. And that’s your group of people that you can take care of everything in your world with, that you wanna have a house, you wanna have a boat, you know, um. Now, the la- the last thing I wanna ask you on this is, I think with boating, it’s one of those things where people get into boating ’cause they were already in boating, their parents or- Right. friend or whoever. Right. The people who are maybe are interested in getting into boating, but they’re afraid that, “I don’t know how to run a boat. I don’t know-” Right. “where to go. “Right. Like, are there ways that people can takeSo, I, so I always, the, you know, and a lot of times, I’ll tell pe- I’ll probably lose deals over telling them, “Why don’t you go and join one of these boat clubs for a little while?”‘Cause like get a lot of customers from that, because it’s people who move to Dartmouth, or move to Marion, or move to somewhere where there’s water, and everyone has a boat except for them. N- not really, but you know, the boating is an important thing, right?Yeah. And, they wanna get into it. And I’ve sold people boats that, that buy a boat and go, “I didn’t know what I was getting into. “But then we, we help ’em, we train ’em. And I spend a lot of time, I spend probably a lot of my time with people who buy, n- I don’t mean a new boat, but a new boat to them. Yeah. New to boating. New boater. But I spend a lot of time, just like I did with you that day, um, showing ’em how to- 17 minutes, by the way, 17 minutes. Showing how to, well- And then Craig atknew that you were gonna be covered with crank, so, you know. Yeah. Um, but th- we spend a lot of time helping them in learning but, or teaching, um, but it’s in, it’s in, it’s important to spend some time with your friends or family that might have boats, and really learn what it’s all about. Because there’s a lot more to it than just jumping in, turning the key, and going. There’s a lot of expense, there’s a lot of responsibility, you can hurt people. Just from the safety side of things that I’ve learned- Y- there’s tons. since I’ve owned a boat. Right, there’s tons. And, and you know, like, you don’t realize, this doesn’t handle like a car, right?It’s not, it doesn’t stop when you want it to. Speed kills. Yeah, speed kills. first thing you said to me. Speed kills. Right. Slow steady. Trying to get to the dock, go as l- go as slow- Hit the dock veryas you want to hit the dock, right?And not put it in gear. Right. Go as fast here as you wanna hit that dock, ’cause that’s what it’s gonna be,Um, but it, it is, like I always tell people, if they’re kind of unsure, ’cause I talk to people all the time, they call me, “Hey, John called me to, he told me to call you to buy a boat. “And I’m like, “What’s your experience?Where are you gonna be boating?”I don’t wanna just sell him a boat and check it off. I wanna ask him about what they’re gonna be doing with it, because he’s like, “Well, I wanna buy a 19-foot boat. I have a family of six and three dogs, and we wanna go to Nantucket. “And I go, “That’s not gonna work,” right?And I go, “Why don’t you start off with a small boat and mess around locally, and then, and then, and then down the road, I’ll be your guy down the road. Like, I don’t need the deal right this second. I want you to learn, and I want you to be comfortable. “Because there’s people who get these boats and aren’t comfortable, and get hurt, or, or just, or get spoiled, and, or get soured, and they say, “Well, boating isn’t for me. “Well, it’s because you had the wrong boat, right?Mm-hmm,Or you had the wrong expectation of what you’re trying to do with that boat. So, the rental thing is really good for people just to get started, have a summer of that, and then they can work their way into it. And it’s a greatthey have that around here?Yeah, they have, I think they have one in Dartmouth, they have, um, a bunch of ’em on the cape. Um, yeah, and it’s like a, it’s like a service where you pay a fee, and then you go on your app and you say, “I want the boat on Tuesday from 10:00 to 12:00. “And you go on, you walk down, the boat’s ready to go, and it’s a good experience for people to learn how toAnd then y- and you don’t have to have a lot of the expense, and you don’t have to deal with, “What am I supposed to do this winter to the boat?”And they, they take care of it, and you show up again, you know?It might t- talk me out of some deals, but at the end of the dayYeah, you’re doing what’s right for them. Yeah, you do what’s right for people, because you want them can say to all of this is just buy your boat from George-’cause I’ve never had to worry about what I’m doing in the winter, where I’m gonna put it. I think I- we help you. We helpI think I put gas in my boat once. That marina that you’re at is pretty cool. Yeah, yeah. I mean, Bardens in Marion. Yeah. And they’re really good, and we have a good relationship with them. You know, we don’t, we, I just rent space from them, but I was a customer for 20 years- Yeah. before I got the office there, and they’ve just been really good. Oh. They’ve been, and they’ve been helpful, Cheryl. Cheryl, Chad, their team over there. Yeah. Like, I was new to boating, still consider myself new to boating, and I can ask them any question, they’re more than happy to answer it. They’re awesome. Right. They’re super. And that’s it, that’s an important part. Like at Oyster Harbors, we, we service probably 4 or 500 boats in, in our location in Osterville. And, um, and, you know, you have a, a service rep that handles everything. You talk to one person, they take care of you, they give you a list of everything that needs to be done. Uh, they, you know, they, they walk you from beginning to end, and the whole boat, you know, maintenance, and service, um, and a plan when you’re, when you have a new boat or any kind of boat there in Osterville, so. Well, George, man, it was a pleasure having you on here. Yeah, fun. Thanks. I wasthink anyone now is gonna totally call The Boat Guy. Yeah, The BoatBoat Guy. You v- you almost talked me into buying a boat, but it’ll take another episode or 2maybe down the line. Get him back next week. Yeah. Put a deposit on the Princess. Yeah. Right. Maybe go get a couple T-dog I’llmaybe we can sell him your boat, and we get you another boat. Whoa, whoa, no. see where this is going. No, no, no. don’t want that dinghy, no. 75-footer. You need somebody with a captain. That’s right. right. I saw him drive my, my, my 25-foot, can you imagine him on a 72?Yeah. Global warming. Twin diesels. Yeah. I need to go fast. Coming right out of the harbor. Yeah. With the top notch. Yeah. What’s that movie?Uh, you, you, you, uh, you scratch my anchor. What’s that guy?That’s definitely gonna be good. Yeah. Well, thanks for coming on, man. It’sthanks for having me. It’s good. Yeah, of course. ‘Til next time.